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Reasons and processes behind reverting to meat-eating?

Yes, I have read a few people online say that they were vegetarian but then started dating meat-eaters or farmers and went back to being omni and raising their own animals on smallholdings. It seems like a bit of a drastic lifestyle change.



I did ask if I could be tested for B12 when I had a blood test and the GP said they usually only tested B12 if there was a health reason. Maybe I should make up a fake symptom and insist next time.
Veganism is a legit medical reason for checking B12.
 

Mischief

Stranger in a strange land
Well, one can live really cheaply on a plant-based diet; the meat/dairy analogs aren't necessary. I do recognize that they are comforting for many people, because one's childhood foods are comforting, but they aren't necessary, and in most cases, not particularly healthy.
 

peacefulveglady

Peacefully Vegan and Proud
Location
Northern IL
Well, one can live really cheaply on a plant-based diet; the meat/dairy analogs aren't necessary. I do recognize that they are comforting for many people, because one's childhood foods are comforting, but they aren't necessary, and in most cases, not particularly healthy.
yes I agree with you there, I do believe that a plant base diet is more cheap then animal products and animal base diets…
 

Blobbenstein

.......
Location
UK.
A lot of animal products aren't that expensive, I think. But the veg*n subs can be like mac and cheese and chocolate.


I'm not sure how I would feel living on cheap veg*n foods like beans, indefinitely.
 

Indian Summer

Cult Leader
Administrator
I'm glad we can have this discussion here. I've always felt that the "just do it, it's so easy!" approach to veg*ism touted by PETA & co was somewhat dishonest. Being a veg*n isn't the easiest thing in the world exactly, which I suppose makes those of us who are pretty special people.

Maybe now we should have another one of those "why are you a veg*n?" threads?
 

SummerRain

I dreamed that God would be forgiving.
Location
UK
I'm glad we can have this discussion here. I've always felt that the "just do it, it's so easy!" approach to veg*ism touted by PETA & co was somewhat dishonest. Being a veg*n isn't the easiest thing in the world exactly, which I suppose makes those of us who are pretty special people.
I think it's ultimately harmful, to "veg*anism" as a whole, but also to individuals. I think it's irresponsible to talk about the health benefits of veganism, for example, without also mentioning the need to make sure you have a source of B12/etc. I know quite a fair few vegans who have recently gone vegan (say, within the last year) and many don't know a lot (and some anything) about the need to supplement/eat fortified foods. It worries me - you need an adequate source of B12.

I do think vegetarianism is slightly different, as there isn't a need to supplement, and it's much more common and a more understood diet.

Although, I understand why it happens. I had this discussion when writing a leaflet on vegan nutrition: how to balance honesty, concern for peoples health, and positivity? You don't want veganism to difficult and daunting and awful, you want to be honest (and yet there's only so much information on vegan nutrition out there) but you also want to be positive (without exaggerating). I think we managed well in the end - we spoke about how all diets have strengths and weaknesses and what they were for a vegan diet I think - but I can see why some people don't want to start writing about B12 and vitamin D and folic acid and iodine and selenium when they want to promote a vegan diet. To most people, all those vitamins sound daunting, and talking about how to get them and how it might be a good idea to take supplements, sounds unhealthy.
 

Mischief

Stranger in a strange land
.


I'm not sure how I would feel living on cheap veg*n foods like beans, indefinitely.
I hardly ever buy fake meat - there are only two that are really edible, and there's no fake cheese that's worth the money, IMO. Sour cream and mayo can easily be made at home.

Not buying fake meats and fake cheeses doesn't equate to living on beans. There is a whole world of vegetables, fruits, grains and legumes out there, and a whole lot of spices.

When I get the craving for something that tastes like chicken, for example, I make a hearty stew of vegetables and chick peas, with dumplings steamed on the top. It's the spices that make it taste like chicken - no fake chicken meat needed.
 

Mischief

Stranger in a strange land
Being a veg*n isn't the easiest thing in the world exactly, which I suppose makes those of us who are pretty special people.
I think it's actually pretty easy to be veg*n. I tend to find the self congratulatory back patting that so many of us indulge in to be rather off-putting.
 

Amy SF

Dweller in nature
I think it's easier to be vegetarian than vegan because Western society is a little more accommodating to vegetarians than to vegans. If you're willing to consume eggs and dairy, it's not hard to find something to order from a menu. At least that's my experience.
 

SummerRain

I dreamed that God would be forgiving.
Location
UK
I think it's actually pretty easy to be veg*n. I tend to find the self congratulatory back patting that so many of us indulge in to be rather off-putting.
Do you think that tends to happen? I haven't experienced much of it with vegans/vegetarians I know.
 

Danielle

forever seeking fire
Location
Illinois
I think it's easier to be vegetarian than vegan because Western society is a little more accommodating to vegetarians than to vegans. If you're willing to consume eggs and dairy, it's not hard to find something to order from a menu. At least that's my experience.
I find that to be true for me, too.
Much easier to find something vegetarian than vegan.
 

nigel

Veteran Member
Location
France
Do you think that tends to happen? I haven't experienced much of it with vegans/vegetarians I know.
I find it to be the norm, myself. What I also find annoying is having a party and preparing a "strict vegetarian meal/buffet for people who eat a vegan diet" and rather than simply enjoying it, my veg* guests rant on at the stupidity of their other friends/family who can't do the same thing.
 
I was a vegetarian for years, then ate meat, then went vegan (or followed a vegan diet, or a dietary vegan, or whatever - I know IS gets upset when you phrase it wrongly, but I'm sure you understand what I mean) and despite daily sublinguals and all kinds of fortified foods, over 3 years my b12 levels sunk so low I was showing physical symptoms of deficiency. We tried to "treat" it for two years. Apparently there are people who just can't get what they need through fortification. After that my only choice was to experiment with b12 injections every two weeks, which I don't see as a solution, or try to work in some alternatives, so I cycle in some animal protein every now and again. It's a better option for me than permanent neurological damage.

In my case I didn't "fall off the wagon" but made a deliberate, calculated choice. I don't see my case as apostasy; I think it depends on your motives in the first place before you can call it that.
Did you try Methylcobalamin supplements? I was very b12 deficient (under 200) when I was vegetarian. They tried the injections, but they did very little. It turned out I couldn't absorb Cyanocobalamin, which is the type that's used to fortify foods and used in injections (unless you specify another type of b12 be used). The Methylcobalamin has made all the difference and my levels are now on the high side. The Methyl b12 is already converted, so it doesn't rely on intrinsic factor to be converted and absorbed.
 

nigel

Veteran Member
Location
France
Did you try Methylcobalamin supplements? I was very b12 deficient (under 200) when I was vegetarian. They tried the injections, but they did very little. It turned out I couldn't absorb Cyanocobalamin, which is the type that's used to fortify foods and used in injections (unless you specify another type of b12 be used). The Methylcobalamin has made all the difference and my levels are now on the high side. The Methyl b12 is already converted, so it doesn't rely on intrinsic factor to be converted and absorbed.
Yes I did, but that's an important point, nonetheless.
 

Mischief

Stranger in a strange land
Do you think that tends to happen? I haven't experienced much of it with vegans/vegetarians I know.
Every veg*n forum I've ever been a part of or have read has been full of this.

One Thanksgiving, I had prepared a big vegan meal. There were about twenty of us around the table, and other than I, there was only one other veg*n. She spent the entire meal lecturing the rest of the guests about how self centered they were for eating meat when they could always eat like this. I couldn't get her to shut up. She did this while wearing leather pants.
 
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Clueless Git

Plant powered
I don't understand what you mean.
I meant there is a degree of realisation that some vegans reach that would make any personal hardship/suffering preferable to reverting to omnivorism, Ledders.

Anyone who see's reverting to omnivorism as being preferable to personal hardship/suffering simply cannot have ever reached that same degree of realisation.

A point of no return on the vegan 'journey', as it were.

The only way to return from a point of no return being, by definition, to have never actualy reached it.
 
M

Moll Flanders

Guest
I think it's easier to be vegetarian than vegan because Western society is a little more accommodating to vegetarians than to vegans. If you're willing to consume eggs and dairy, it's not hard to find something to order from a menu. At least that's my experience.
Definitely.

I found it was far easier to be vegetarian than a vegan. I don't find being vegan difficult now (although I did at first!) but I can imagine other people would find it hard if they live in an area that only has steakhouses or they have a lot of family pressure to eat meat and dairy or they have to eat out a lot for work and find it difficult to find vegan food in restaurants or they have disordered eating or they have limited money to buy vegan footwear etc, etc... I think being vegan can be quite isolating too if you don't have like-minded people to talk to.
 
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