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Music Morrissey and the far right

Jamie in Chile

Renowned Member
Morrissey has supported one right wing party here, and he does appear to be right wing on immigration and EU membership - on that specific issue. However I don't think it's fair to characterize him as right wing, because some of his opinions are more left wing. I wouldn't say he is left either.
 

Jon

Well Known Member
What you're all forgetting is that racism only goes one way. If you say you're proud of being English, British or whatever, you're called racist. This has actually happened to me more than once. We should be more like the americans, in that way, be proud of who you are and let people know it. And it's time we played fair with left wing, right wing whatever. Everybody is entitled to their views and opinions. It doesn't matter of you agree with them or not, they are entitled to them. And they're entitled to say so. If that upsets someone, hard luck they should not be so touchy like the "snowflake brigade" of most of today's youngsters. They can't tolerate views that don't agree with theirs. We can't always agree with everyone else, we all have our views on things. If you want someone to respect your entitlement to your views, then you should give them the same entitlement even if you don't agree. This world and life is not black and white, it's every shade of colour there is and many we can't see. We should be far more tolerant of others views.
 

Jamie in Chile

Renowned Member
Do you think we should be tolerant of someone's view that say, all children should be ritually slaughtered at the age of 5? Or that all people of a specified ethnicity should be killed on sight?

If yes, then you are tolerant of any view. If not, then you are not tolerant of some views and it's just a question of which ones.

Not all views are tolerable. There will always be a subjective judgement to be made about which ones are and which ones are not.

So just a call for tolerance is only a part of the story. To me "gay marriage is a sin" is not an acceptable viewpoint. To others, it is.
 

Jon

Well Known Member
I didn't specify any particular view. Of course there are some views that are unacceptable under any circumstances. What I said was that everyone has views and are entitled to them. Whether they are acceptable is another matter entirely. But you have to respect that they are entitled to their views, right or wrong. As you said, what is right for one, is not for another. To coin a phrase, "One mans meat is another man's poison" There's a lot of views we would all disagree about. That's not the point I was trying to make, only that everyone is entitled to their views. I agree with you about gay marriage, but someone else would not and they are entitled to that. jc
 

shyvas

Deity
Forum Moderator
I didn't specify any particular view. Of course there are some views that are unacceptable under any circumstances. What I said was that everyone has views and are entitled to them. Whether they are acceptable is another matter entirely. But you have to respect that they are entitled to their views, right or wrong. As you said, what is right for one, is not for another. To coin a phrase, "One mans meat is another man's poison" There's a lot of views we would all disagree about. That's not the point I was trying to make, only that everyone is entitled to their views. I agree with you about gay marriage, but someone else would not and they are entitled to that. jc
That is how I have also understood your above post.
 

Andy_T

Addicted Poster
Forum Moderator
Everybody is entitled to their views and opinions. It doesn't matter of you agree with them or not, they are entitled to them. And they're entitled to say so.
Absolutely.

And of course everybody else is entitled to call them out on those opinions if they do not agree with them ;)

Or would that possibly fall under
hard luck they should not be so touchy like the "snowflake brigade" of most of today's youngsters.
by that logic?
 
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Andy_T

Addicted Poster
Forum Moderator
Morrissey has supported one right wing party here, and he does appear to be right wing on immigration and EU membership - on that specific issue.
Now here's the thing about supporting and advocating for political parties. While you might "only" agree with specific parts of a party's program, the moment you put their logo on your lapel (or check their ballot in the voting booth) you endorse all that they have put on their program.

In the words of a person wiser than me: "It's not trail mix where you can just pick out the things you like and leave the things you don't like" If you endorse them, you have to accept that you are associated with everything they argue for.

But, in the case of "For Britain", as far as I could research, stopping immigration from Muslim countries and "Bringing the whole EU project down" seem to be the only objectives I can discern. Oh, and "Lower Taxes", of course.
 
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Indian Summer

Cult Leader
Administrator
If you say you're proud of being English, British or whatever, you're called racist.
The "proud to be X" sort of statements never made a lot of sense to me. I don't think it's racist necessarily, just not making sense. I can be proud of my achievements, but being proud of something I didn't put any effort into just sounds nonsensical. But if I said "I feel *lucky* to be Norwegian / white / from a good family" that would be both true and sensical.
 

Indian Summer

Cult Leader
Administrator
While you might "only" agree with specific parts of a party's program, the moment you put their logo on your lapel (or check their ballot in the voting booth) you endorse all that they have put on their program.
I dunno, when I vote, it's always for the least worse option. There's always something on which I disagree with them. So I think, while similar, voting for someone and actually endorsing them are two slightly different actions. This is even more true in countries with multiple rounds of elections where candidates are eliminated so you may need to vote for someone else in the next round.
 

Indian Summer

Cult Leader
Administrator
The "proud to be X" sort of statements never made a lot of sense to me. I don't think it's racist necessarily, just not making sense. I can be proud of my achievements, but being proud of something I didn't put any effort into just sounds nonsensical. But if I said "I feel *lucky* to be Norwegian / white / from a good family" that would be both true and sensical.
Maybe someone could also say they're grateful for the efforts of their ancestors (parents, grandparents, ...) that have benefited later generations of the family, typically the accumulation of wealth, land, property. Similarly, they could be grateful for the efforts their countrymen of times past, that have benefited later generations in some way. (That said, there are always ancestors or countrymen who have done something that pulls the other way, something that has put later generations at a disadvantage ...)

So to summarise, feelings of luck and gratitude could be justified and rational, but pride seems less so.
 

Andy_T

Addicted Poster
Forum Moderator
Maybe someone could also say they're grateful for the efforts of their ancestors (parents, grandparents, ...) that have benefited later generations of the family, typically the accumulation of wealth, land, property.
Reminds me of this (supposedly quite ancient) cartoon ...
estate.jpg
 
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